Microsoft's stance on "backups"

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This topic has 5 voices, contains 7 replies, and was last updated by avatar QuickMythril 2206 days ago.

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2011-09-25 at 01:32PM UTC #1149
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QuickMythril

Just thought i’d share a little story that happened to me. I used to have an ad online advertising that i do 360 repairs and mods to allow playing of backed up games. I also advertised that i could create backups for people who had their own copy of the game. I made sure that my wording was very careful because i didn’t want people to think i was just selling burned games. Well, regardless i received a Cease And Desist letter from good old MS. Actually they emailed me AND i suppose got my physical home address from my ISP. So i took this very seriously. There was a Microsoft Anti-Piracy support 800 number so i called to clear everything up. This is what they told me:

Microsoft does not follow the supposed rule that anyone can have one copy or backup of any game they already own. They consider backups to be counterfeit games. They also said they recognised the difference between what i was advertising and the people who basically have a list of burned games for sale. They said there is no problem with me replacing drives and putting the proper dvd key onto them, as well as any other repairs. They said if i continued to modify consoles to play backups i could receive something like $1000 fine for each console, AND they said something crazy like $10.000 fine for EACH backup created.

Just a word of caution to anyone who thinks they should try to profit from circumventing their security. Probably also part of the reason c4e doesn’t charge for CFW. I have of course since taken down my ads, and stopped even messing around with 360s. I honestly don’t even have time for console games lately with my daughter starting school and me changing residences. I actually bought a Samsung Focus, but didn’t activate service on it. I can still connect to my wi-fi and buy WP7 games from the marketplace. It’s kind of like my little touch screen Microsoft Gameboy. Side note: Mango comes out for the rev 1.3 Focus in a few days.

2011-09-25 at 03:23PM UTC #1158
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Mclane

No disrespect but advertising about creating backups wasn’t your finest plan, did you not think it would attract interest?

The people who have flashed my machine never ever offered me copies, talked about copies or offered links, that’s the way people should be. As for the modifying side, I think you would be hard pressed to actually get into serious trouble for that alone, yes MS will rightly warn you and put the frighteners on you but in real life I doubt they are interested in the modders, they want the suppliers, the factories that make console mods for playing disc, another words the big boys. The will though give people supplying games a good working over which is why in this day and age if you offer copies then you pretty much deserve to get a slap from them.

As for your story, I’ll trump it a little, this next bit is actually 100% true.

Back in the late 70′s one person I was going to become a friend of was the first person in the UK ever to be taken to court for computer piracy, he was taken to court for selling cartridge images on disk that worked without the cartridge. This was in the day before the term software piracy, this was in the day of the first home computers. The silly sod was advertising in a selling paper called Exchange and Mart, a very well know mag to buy 2nd hand goods at the time. Atari UK found out about his advert and went around and purchased some disks, he was then arrested and was taken to the high court in London.

Atari settled out of court (the computer legalities were not around then) and he was made to sign a statement saying he would never do that again, he also had quite large costs against him.

The true twist in this story is that the roms on disk were coming from insiders in Atari Slough themselves…

I think one of the games was Ms Pacman…

All 100% true…

Moral here, don’t be daft and advertise & don’t do that sort of stuff if you don’t want to be caught..

Its a fools game, like me, keep well clear…Enjoy the games whatever way people get them but don’t make money out of it & expect to get away with it…

2011-09-25 at 05:16PM UTC #1164
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vinnymac

I have never advertised backups as an option to anyone. I also don’t see why you need to advertise. Just go local, meet with the people who need the job done. I always kept it in a circle of friends of friends, and no messy MS business. It sucks that MS did that, but they were more or less trying to scare you.

I used to run a Nintendo DS Roms site called NDS-roms.com and I used to get Cease and Desist letters from the game publishers all the time. They never actually did anything. Plus since I never purchased the domain myself, they couldn’t really link anything back to me. And most of my servers were offshore aswell.

2011-09-25 at 05:40PM UTC #1165
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QuickMythril

that’s pretty much what i was trying to point out to people… same thing you said. don’t expect to make money, and don’t advertise something like that if you don’t want the attention. i wasn’t bragging or anything. also since we are in a forum discussing firmware that plays xgd3 backups, i wanted to point out that Microsoft doesn’t consider backing up your games something you should be able to do. i am sure many people like me believed the myth that it is legal to own a backup copy of any media you own.

2011-09-25 at 06:15PM UTC #1171
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Mclane

Oh don’t worry, I never said you were bragging, but if you offer a backing up service for people who own the game, even that will get MS pissed, those that offer to sell copies are in a world of pain if caught.

As far a a backup, I believe the stance as seen in law is that you only own the right to play the game on that media, you are not allowed to spread it, alter the media (there may be a percentage in that) or do any form of copy because MS offer the ability to get another copy from them (even if its full price).

2011-12-03 at 07:26AM UTC #4658
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blacKOutuu

This is all true. If you read the licensing on any game media for xbox or xbox 360. It clearly states, “You are not purchasing a legal hard copy of the item provided. You are simply purchasing a license to play the rightful media and they just loan you the hard copy of the media. If ppl would read fine pront, it would make sense. No copy or backup of “copyrighted” material is legal. Sorry, hence the reason copy right huh lol. Anyone that would take the time to read the fine print would see this stuff and laugh as hard as I have

2011-12-04 at 01:07AM UTC #4684
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Ucla

Yeah but, that license agreement is M$’ make believe version to avoid the law. It’s like a dairy farmer claiming you are buying the gallon but we own the cow and you can only drink the milk at certain times. This has been challenged as far as dvds and music goes which allows you to make a copy. Thats the same principal. The issue is no one on either side of the debate has yet to actually challenge this. M$ can use whatever make believe term they want according to what they calm their games but, laws like the digital millennium copy right act are created to protect the company and at the same time give rights to the consumer so the company doesn’t limit something you legally own. Imo this is the same as when Apple challenged the law and lost over iphone unlocking/jail breaking. Even though Apple lost they will never admit you are allowed to and will always try to re-lock their device.

2011-12-04 at 01:52AM UTC #4685
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QuickMythril

yes good example ucla, i remember working at a call center for ipod, we told customers that moving music off of the ipod was “unsupported” but most people said you can find more info if you do a web search. obviously you just show hidden folders and it’s all there in the Content folder.

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